Miatapower List Archive

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Mail From: Ian McCloghrie <(email redacted)>

On Nov 1, 2006 (email redacted) wrote:
> a lot of work....hmmm. Prolly $600 to $1200 for the heads then the install
> plus gaskets and a EEC retune with bigger injectors and a larger MAF. Yeah
> alot of work.

OK. That seems like less work than getting decent FI power out of a Miata
(installing an FM2 kit, let's say). It's certainly a lot less work than
getting significant NA power out of a Miata (bottom end rebuild to get
higher-compression pistons, new cams, port/polish, etc).

--Ian

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Mail From: "Abraham Mara" <(email redacted)>

It'd be pretty ridiclous to suggest making v8 power on an NA miata. *maybe*
on something like an S2000 or something with some displacement to it like a
350Z....

You could make the argument that an FMII is an "external" mod.

How does the price of an FMII compare to that of a:
5.0 motor, running
Head swap
Tranny
Rear end
mods to get it into the frame

Seems ridiculous to me. Plus, you already own a miata motor. The only
point to a motor swap is if you are going to build it, and if you need more
than 300 hp. And even then it's debatable. If you want 250 whp build a
miata motor.
-Abe.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ian McCloghrie" <(email redacted)>


> On Nov 1, 2006 (email redacted) wrote:
>> a lot of work....hmmm. Prolly $600 to $1200 for the heads then the
>> install
>> plus gaskets and a EEC retune with bigger injectors and a larger MAF.
>> Yeah
>> alot of work.
>
> OK. That seems like less work than getting decent FI power out of a Miata
> (installing an FM2 kit, let's say). It's certainly a lot less work than
> getting significant NA power out of a Miata (bottom end rebuild to get
> higher-compression pistons, new cams, port/polish, etc).
>
> --Ian
>

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Mail From: Ian McCloghrie <(email redacted)>

On Nov 1, 2006 "Abraham Mara" wrote:
> It'd be pretty ridiclous to suggest making v8 power on an NA miata. *maybe*
> on something like an S2000 or something with some displacement to it like a
> 350Z....

Well, a stock 5.0 makes something like 220 rwhp. From what I
understand, you can approach NA that if you're willing to go nuts and
spend a TON of money.

> You could make the argument that an FMII is an "external" mod.

Sure, but that doesn't mean it's a trivial bolt-on. :)

I'm saying that making a 5.0 Mustang make 300+ rwhp with heads/etc is
easier than making a Miata do 200+ rwhp with an FM2.

> How does the price of an FMII compare to that of a:
> 5.0 motor, running
> Head swap
> Tranny
> Rear end
> mods to get it into the frame
>
> Seems ridiculous to me. Plus, you already own a miata motor. The only
> point to a motor swap is if you are going to build it, and if you need more
> than 300 hp. And even then it's debatable. If you want 250 whp build a
> miata motor.

Sure, I'm not trying to say that a V8 transplant is more
cost-effective than a turbo kit (at least, not until your goal is in
excess of 300rwhp).

But the original post I responded to claimed that getting a 5.0 to make
300 rwhp was hard and/or required a lot of money. While that may be
true if you're looking at mods to an existing Mustang, the costs and
work involved in doing the Miata conversion dwarf the bits you have to
put on the 5.0 to get the power up. If you're spending $15K on a
5.0 conversion, what's another couple grand for some Trick Flow heads,
a new cam, some bigger injectors and a MAF? If the engine is already on
an engine stand, installing new heads is just a few hours of
wrenching.

--Ian

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Mail From: "Abraham Mara" <(email redacted)>

On that, at least, I agree. Given the work to put in a V-8 you'd might as
well build a good one.

That said, why would you put in an NA V8 unless it was some hot shit? If
you're not using forced induction then you're not serious about power on
pretty much any car you care to build. If you just want a v8 miata, fine,
toss in 250 rwhp and say you've got it. I'd rather have a 300 hp screamer,
and it would be cheaper to build and easier to do than a v8 swap tuned to
that level.

You can put quite a bit of motor into a Miata on a stock motor. Honestly,
the only motors that seem interesting are mid sized v6's, saving weight and
with forced induction you can really get some big numbers out of them. THAT
would make for a fun, balanced car.
-Abe.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ian McCloghrie" <(email redacted)>


> On Nov 1, 2006 "Abraham Mara" wrote:
>> It'd be pretty ridiclous to suggest making v8 power on an NA miata.
>> *maybe*
>> on something like an S2000 or something with some displacement to it like
>> a
>> 350Z....
>
> Well, a stock 5.0 makes something like 220 rwhp. From what I
> understand, you can approach NA that if you're willing to go nuts and
> spend a TON of money.
>
>> You could make the argument that an FMII is an "external" mod.
>
> Sure, but that doesn't mean it's a trivial bolt-on. :)
>
> I'm saying that making a 5.0 Mustang make 300+ rwhp with heads/etc is
> easier than making a Miata do 200+ rwhp with an FM2.
>
>> How does the price of an FMII compare to that of a:
>> 5.0 motor, running
>> Head swap
>> Tranny
>> Rear end
>> mods to get it into the frame
>>
>> Seems ridiculous to me. Plus, you already own a miata motor. The only
>> point to a motor swap is if you are going to build it, and if you need
>> more
>> than 300 hp. And even then it's debatable. If you want 250 whp build a
>> miata motor.
>
> Sure, I'm not trying to say that a V8 transplant is more
> cost-effective than a turbo kit (at least, not until your goal is in
> excess of 300rwhp).
>
> But the original post I responded to claimed that getting a 5.0 to make
> 300 rwhp was hard and/or required a lot of money. While that may be
> true if you're looking at mods to an existing Mustang, the costs and
> work involved in doing the Miata conversion dwarf the bits you have to
> put on the 5.0 to get the power up. If you're spending $15K on a
> 5.0 conversion, what's another couple grand for some Trick Flow heads,
> a new cam, some bigger injectors and a MAF? If the engine is already on
> an engine stand, installing new heads is just a few hours of
> wrenching.
>
> --Ian
>

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: Ian McCloghrie <(email redacted)>

On Nov 1, 2006 "Abraham Mara" wrote:
> That said, why would you put in an NA V8 unless it was some hot shit? If

There are people who've done V8 conversions on the cheap, using lots of
labor and fabrication skill to do all of the conversion work themselves.
If you have the skills and equipment, all you need to buy is a junker
5.0 Mustang, a t-bird rear end, and some custom half-shafts -- with
appropriate resourcefulness you could probably do it for less than
a grand. A few guys did a V8 Miata for the GRM 200x dollar challenge,
spending less than 2 grand on the whole car.

> you're not using forced induction then you're not serious about power on
> pretty much any car you care to build. If you just want a v8 miata, fine,

For a Miata motor, I tend to agree (unless rules force you to go NA).
For other engines it's less obvious.

> toss in 250 rwhp and say you've got it. I'd rather have a 300 hp screamer,
> and it would be cheaper to build and easier to do than a v8 swap tuned to
> that level.

A friend of mine has a naturally aspirated 5.0 making 380/380 at
the wheels, with at least 300 lb-ft all the way from 2500 to 6500 RPM
(7K redline). I'd love to have a motor like that in a Miata. :)

If you're already cramming a V8 under the hood, finding room for the FI
compressor and intercooler makes it quite a bit harder. Cooling a big
motor like that has got to be a lot easier without having an
intercooler blocking your airflow as well.

--Ian

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Mail From: (email redacted)


While it can be done on the cheap, the normal approach is to use the
Monster Miata kit. Plan on spending near $10k altogether for the completed
project before you add hp to the engine. The stock 5.0 is rated around 225
at the crank. The one that dynoed the same day I did got 220 TQ and 176HP
at the wheels on a Dyno dynamics dyno.

How much $4 went into that 380 HP 5.0 ? Approaching 300hp the blocks are
known to split. Aftermarket blocks are as much as two or three junkyard 1.8
l Miata engines.

Steve



Ian McCloghrie
<(email redacted)>
To
11/01/2006 06:59 Abraham Mara
PM <(email redacted)>
cc
(email redacted)
Please respond to Subject
(email redacted) Re: - Building my second turbo
Miata.... advice please










On Nov 1, 2006 "Abraham Mara" wrote:
> That said, why would you put in an NA V8 unless it was some hot shit? If


There are people who've done V8 conversions on the cheap, using lots of
labor and fabrication skill to do all of the conversion work themselves.
If you have the skills and equipment, all you need to buy is a junker
5.0 Mustang, a t-bird rear end, and some custom half-shafts -- with
appropriate resourcefulness you could probably do it for less than
a grand. A few guys did a V8 Miata for the GRM 200x dollar challenge,
spending less than 2 grand on the whole car.

> you're not using forced induction then you're not serious about power on
> pretty much any car you care to build. If you just want a v8 miata,
fine,

For a Miata motor, I tend to agree (unless rules force you to go NA).
For other engines it's less obvious.

> toss in 250 rwhp and say you've got it. I'd rather have a 300 hp
screamer,
> and it would be cheaper to build and easier to do than a v8 swap tuned to

> that level.

A friend of mine has a naturally aspirated 5.0 making 380/380 at
the wheels, with at least 300 lb-ft all the way from 2500 to 6500 RPM
(7K redline). I'd love to have a motor like that in a Miata. :)

If you're already cramming a V8 under the hood, finding room for the FI
compressor and intercooler makes it quite a bit harder. Cooling a big
motor like that has got to be a lot easier without having an
intercooler blocking your airflow as well.

--Ian

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Mail From: "corky" <(email redacted)>

Do any of the splendid 3.0 to 4.0 V6's spark any interest? That could sure
be my cup of tea.

corky



-----Original Message-----
From: (email redacted) [mailto:(email redacted)]
Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2006 8:18 AM
To: (email redacted)
Cc: Abraham Mara; (email redacted)
Subject: Re: - Building my second turbo Miata.... advice please


While it can be done on the cheap, the normal approach is to use the
Monster Miata kit. Plan on spending near $10k altogether for the completed
project before you add hp to the engine. The stock 5.0 is rated around 225
at the crank. The one that dynoed the same day I did got 220 TQ and 176HP
at the wheels on a Dyno dynamics dyno.

How much $4 went into that 380 HP 5.0 ? Approaching 300hp the blocks are
known to split. Aftermarket blocks are as much as two or three junkyard 1.8
l Miata engines.

Steve



Ian McCloghrie
<(email redacted)>
To
11/01/2006 06:59 Abraham Mara
PM <(email redacted)>
cc
(email redacted)
Please respond to Subject
(email redacted) Re: - Building my second turbo
Miata.... advice please










On Nov 1, 2006 "Abraham Mara" wrote:
> That said, why would you put in an NA V8 unless it was some hot shit? If


There are people who've done V8 conversions on the cheap, using lots of
labor and fabrication skill to do all of the conversion work themselves.
If you have the skills and equipment, all you need to buy is a junker
5.0 Mustang, a t-bird rear end, and some custom half-shafts -- with
appropriate resourcefulness you could probably do it for less than
a grand. A few guys did a V8 Miata for the GRM 200x dollar challenge,
spending less than 2 grand on the whole car.

> you're not using forced induction then you're not serious about power on
> pretty much any car you care to build. If you just want a v8 miata,
fine,

For a Miata motor, I tend to agree (unless rules force you to go NA).
For other engines it's less obvious.

> toss in 250 rwhp and say you've got it. I'd rather have a 300 hp
screamer,
> and it would be cheaper to build and easier to do than a v8 swap tuned to

> that level.

A friend of mine has a naturally aspirated 5.0 making 380/380 at
the wheels, with at least 300 lb-ft all the way from 2500 to 6500 RPM
(7K redline). I'd love to have a motor like that in a Miata. :)

If you're already cramming a V8 under the hood, finding room for the FI
compressor and intercooler makes it quite a bit harder. Cooling a big
motor like that has got to be a lot easier without having an
intercooler blocking your airflow as well.

--Ian

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Mail From: (email redacted)


I see Granny's Speed Shop is selling mounting hardware to put a Nissan VQ
into the RX7. That would be a better direction that the Ford 5.0in the
Miata IMO. Lots of potential in that engine.

Steve



corky
<corky@bellengine
ering.net> To
(email redacted),
11/02/2006 09:24 (email redacted)
AM cc
'Abraham Mara'
<(email redacted)>,
(email redacted)
Subject
RE: - Building my second turbo
Miata.... advice please










Do any of the splendid 3.0 to 4.0 V6's spark any interest? That could
sure
be my cup of tea.

corky



-----Original Message-----
From: (email redacted) [mailto:(email redacted)]
Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2006 8:18 AM
To: (email redacted)
Cc: Abraham Mara; (email redacted)
Subject: Re: - Building my second turbo Miata.... advice please


While it can be done on the cheap, the normal approach is to use the
Monster Miata kit. Plan on spending near $10k altogether for the completed
project before you add hp to the engine. The stock 5.0 is rated around 225
at the crank. The one that dynoed the same day I did got 220 TQ and 176HP
at the wheels on a Dyno dynamics dyno.

How much $4 went into that 380 HP 5.0 ? Approaching 300hp the blocks are
known to split. Aftermarket blocks are as much as two or three junkyard 1.8
l Miata engines.

Steve



Ian McCloghrie
<(email redacted)>
To
11/01/2006 06:59 Abraham Mara
PM <(email redacted)>
cc
(email redacted)
Please respond to Subject
(email redacted) Re: - Building my second turbo
Miata.... advice please










On Nov 1, 2006 "Abraham Mara" wrote:
> That said, why would you put in an NA V8 unless it was some hot shit? If


There are people who've done V8 conversions on the cheap, using lots of
labor and fabrication skill to do all of the conversion work themselves.
If you have the skills and equipment, all you need to buy is a junker
5.0 Mustang, a t-bird rear end, and some custom half-shafts -- with
appropriate resourcefulness you could probably do it for less than
a grand. A few guys did a V8 Miata for the GRM 200x dollar challenge,
spending less than 2 grand on the whole car.

> you're not using forced induction then you're not serious about power on
> pretty much any car you care to build. If you just want a v8 miata,
fine,

For a Miata motor, I tend to agree (unless rules force you to go NA).
For other engines it's less obvious.

> toss in 250 rwhp and say you've got it. I'd rather have a 300 hp
screamer,
> and it would be cheaper to build and easier to do than a v8 swap tuned to

> that level.

A friend of mine has a naturally aspirated 5.0 making 380/380 at
the wheels, with at least 300 lb-ft all the way from 2500 to 6500 RPM
(7K redline). I'd love to have a motor like that in a Miata. :)

If you're already cramming a V8 under the hood, finding room for the FI
compressor and intercooler makes it quite a bit harder. Cooling a big
motor like that has got to be a lot easier without having an
intercooler blocking your airflow as well.

--Ian

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______________________________________________________________________
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Mail From: Rob Ebersol <(email redacted)>

A guy put a Mazda 2.5 KL v6 in an NA (documented in the m.net engine
swap forum). That engine seems to work will with turbos too. I know
of an MX3 running 400whp at 15psi (AF 10.5:1). It's his daily driver-
been like this for two years. Says he shows "no mercy". That could be
fun. I loved the 95 v6 626 5spd I had.

On Nov 2, 2006, at 10:24 AM, corky wrote:

> Do any of the splendid 3.0 to 4.0 V6's spark any interest? That
> could sure
> be my cup of tea.

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Mail From: (email redacted)


I dislike the sound most V6's make. The exceptions being the Mazda KL 2.5 V6 and the Nissan 300z. I don't know what they did (bore, cam timing, ?) but with the right mufflers they sound good.

Randy


-----Original Message-----
From: (email redacted)
To: (email redacted); (email redacted)
Cc: (email redacted); (email redacted)
Sent: Thu, 2 Nov 2006 10:24 AM
Subject: RE: - Building my second turbo Miata.... advice please


Do any of the splendid 3.0 to 4.0 V6's spark any interest? That could sure
be my cup of tea.

corky
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Mail From: (email redacted)

IIRC that Nissan is a physically big engine. Might not fit in the Miata engine bay too well.




-----Original Message-----
From: (email redacted)
To: (email redacted)
Cc: (email redacted); (email redacted); (email redacted)
Sent: Thu, 2 Nov 2006 10:33 AM
Subject: RE: - Building my second turbo Miata.... advice please



I see Granny's Speed Shop is selling mounting hardware to put a Nissan VQ
into the RX7. That would be a better direction that the Ford 5.0in the
Miata IMO. Lots of potential in that engine.

Steve



corky
<corky@bellengine
ering.net> To
(email redacted),
11/02/2006 09:24 (email redacted)
AM cc
'Abraham Mara'
<(email redacted)>,
(email redacted)
Subject
RE: - Building my second turbo
Miata.... advice please










Do any of the splendid 3.0 to 4.0 V6's spark any interest? That could
sure
be my cup of tea.

corky



-----Original Message-----
From: (email redacted) [mailto:(email redacted)]
Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2006 8:18 AM
To: (email redacted)
Cc: Abraham Mara; (email redacted)
Subject: Re: - Building my second turbo Miata.... advice please


While it can be done on the cheap, the normal approach is to use the
Monster Miata kit. Plan on spending near $10k altogether for the completed
project before you add hp to the engine. The stock 5.0 is rated around 225
at the crank. The one that dynoed the same day I did got 220 TQ and 176HP
at the wheels on a Dyno dynamics dyno.

How much $4 went into that 380 HP 5.0 ? Approaching 300hp the blocks are
known to split. Aftermarket blocks are as much as two or three junkyard 1.8
l Miata engines.

Steve



Ian McCloghrie
<(email redacted)>
To
11/01/2006 06:59 Abraham Mara
PM <(email redacted)>
cc
(email redacted)
Please respond to Subject
(email redacted) Re: - Building my second turbo
Miata.... advice please










On Nov 1, 2006 "Abraham Mara" wrote:
> That said, why would you put in an NA V8 unless it was some hot shit? If


There are people who've done V8 conversions on the cheap, using lots of
labor and fabrication skill to do all of the conversion work themselves.
If you have the skills and equipment, all you need to buy is a junker
5.0 Mustang, a t-bird rear end, and some custom half-shafts -- with
appropriate resourcefulness you could probably do it for less than
a grand. A few guys did a V8 Miata for the GRM 200x dollar challenge,
spending less than 2 grand on the whole car.

> you're not using forced induction then you're not serious about power on
> pretty much any car you care to build. If you just want a v8 miata,
fine,

For a Miata motor, I tend to agree (unless rules force you to go NA).
For other engines it's less obvious.

> toss in 250 rwhp and say you've got it. I'd rather have a 300 hp
screamer,
> and it would be cheaper to build and easier to do than a v8 swap tuned to

> that level.

A friend of mine has a naturally aspirated 5.0 making 380/380 at
the wheels, with at least 300 lb-ft all the way from 2500 to 6500 RPM
(7K redline). I'd love to have a motor like that in a Miata. :)

If you're already cramming a V8 under the hood, finding room for the FI
compressor and intercooler makes it quite a bit harder. Cooling a big
motor like that has got to be a lot easier without having an
intercooler blocking your airflow as well.

--Ian

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confidential and privileged information. If you are not the intended
recipient, your use, forwarding, printing, storing, disseminating,
distribution, or copying of this communication is prohibited. If you
received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately
by replying to this message and delete it from your computer.


______________________________________________________________________
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______________________________________________________________________


_____________
This e-mail transmission and any attachments to it are intended solely for
the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed and may contain
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received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately
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Mail From: "Loercher, Scott" <(email redacted)>


>If you have the skills and equipment, all you need to buy is a junker
5.0 Mustang,
>a t-bird rear end, and some custom half-shafts -- with appropriate
resourcefulness
>you could probably do it for less than a grand. A few guys did a V8
Miata for the
>GRM 200x dollar challenge, spending less than 2 grand on the whole car.

As co-owner of that car, I know how cheap it could be done. Our base
car was bought for $2300 and sold down to $0 before we even began the
build. I don't know if under $1,000 is possible, but we were under $2k
even with the expensive axels v8miata.com. The car is still street
driven and auto-x'd from time to time.

v8miata.homestead.com/buildup.html

That car will be for sale shortly, feel free to e-mail if interested.

-Scott

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Mail From: Rob Ebersol <(email redacted)>

I can think of two words as to why that car would be difficult for
the average joe to duplicate: 1. skills 2. tools

That car is is an amazing achievement given the $ spent and the
quality of work. It looks like a $20k conversion.

On Nov 2, 2006, at 10:52 AM, Loercher, Scott wrote:

> As co-owner of that car, I know how cheap it could be done. Our
> base car was bought for $2300 and sold down to $0 before we even
> began the build. I don't know if under $1,000 is possible, but we
> were under $2k even with the expensive axels v8miata.com. The car
> is still street driven and auto-x'd from time to time.
>
> v8miata.homestead.com/buildup.html
>
> That car will be for sale shortly, feel free to e-mail if interested.
>
> -Scott
>

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Mail From: "Abraham Mara" <(email redacted)>

Heh - is there an echo in here? :-P I was just saying that seems to be the
right motor for the car. What's the weight difference in a small alum V-6
verses a V8?

I can't pretend the Z motor is lightweight, but it's bolt-ons to 400 hp.
I'm sure it wouldn't be hard to come up with some V6 motors that could
lighten the Miata and, with some creative plumbing, breath well.

Pickups are where I would look for driveline. How about the toyota avalon?
Doesn't that have a nice, large, all alum v-6 in it? For that matter, what
about the supercharged motor from the Buicks or the GrandAm GTP?
-Abe.
P.S. Are there drawings of the tranny mounting points on a BP engine
anywhere? The FE3?

----- Original Message -----
From: "corky" <(email redacted)>


> Do any of the splendid 3.0 to 4.0 V6's spark any interest? That could
> sure
> be my cup of tea.
>
> corky
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: (email redacted) [mailto:(email redacted)]
> Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2006 8:18 AM
> To: (email redacted)
> Cc: Abraham Mara; (email redacted)
> Subject: Re: - Building my second turbo Miata.... advice please
>
>
> While it can be done on the cheap, the normal approach is to use the
> Monster Miata kit. Plan on spending near $10k altogether for the completed
> project before you add hp to the engine. The stock 5.0 is rated around 225
> at the crank. The one that dynoed the same day I did got 220 TQ and 176HP
> at the wheels on a Dyno dynamics dyno.
>
> How much $4 went into that 380 HP 5.0 ? Approaching 300hp the blocks are
> known to split. Aftermarket blocks are as much as two or three junkyard
> 1.8
> l Miata engines.
>
> Steve
>
>
>
> Ian McCloghrie
> <(email redacted)>
> To
> 11/01/2006 06:59 Abraham Mara
> PM <(email redacted)>
> cc
> (email redacted)
> Please respond to Subject
> (email redacted) Re: - Building my second turbo
> Miata.... advice please
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Nov 1, 2006 "Abraham Mara" wrote:
>> That said, why would you put in an NA V8 unless it was some hot shit? If
>
>
> There are people who've done V8 conversions on the cheap, using lots of
> labor and fabrication skill to do all of the conversion work themselves.
> If you have the skills and equipment, all you need to buy is a junker
> 5.0 Mustang, a t-bird rear end, and some custom half-shafts -- with
> appropriate resourcefulness you could probably do it for less than
> a grand. A few guys did a V8 Miata for the GRM 200x dollar challenge,
> spending less than 2 grand on the whole car.
>
>> you're not using forced induction then you're not serious about power on
>> pretty much any car you care to build. If you just want a v8 miata,
> fine,
>
> For a Miata motor, I tend to agree (unless rules force you to go NA).
> For other engines it's less obvious.
>
>> toss in 250 rwhp and say you've got it. I'd rather have a 300 hp
> screamer,
>> and it would be cheaper to build and easier to do than a v8 swap tuned to
>
>> that level.
>
> A friend of mine has a naturally aspirated 5.0 making 380/380 at
> the wheels, with at least 300 lb-ft all the way from 2500 to 6500 RPM
> (7K redline). I'd love to have a motor like that in a Miata. :)
>
> If you're already cramming a V8 under the hood, finding room for the FI
> compressor and intercooler makes it quite a bit harder. Cooling a big
> motor like that has got to be a lot easier without having an
> intercooler blocking your airflow as well.
>
> --Ian
>
> ______________________________________________________________________
> This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
> For more information please visit messagelabs.com/email
> ______________________________________________________________________
>
>
> _____________
> This e-mail transmission and any attachments to it are intended solely for
> the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed and may
> contain
> confidential and privileged information. If you are not the intended
> recipient, your use, forwarding, printing, storing, disseminating,
> distribution, or copying of this communication is prohibited. If you
> received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately
> by replying to this message and delete it from your computer.
>
>

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted)

Sounds like you are thinking of adapting a V6 to the Miata trans. Keep in mind that V engines usually have the starter low to fit the outside of the V while strait engines usually have them mounted high close to the block. Any adaptation for the Miata trans would likely have to take into account relocation of the starter. BTDT.

No drawings but I have captured many closeup pics of ebay transmission bellhousing patterns (resize in phtotshop and overlay to see pattern differences).




P.S. Are there drawings of the tranny mounting points on a BP engine anywhere? The FE3?

----- Original Message ----- From: "corky" <(email redacted)>

> Do any of the splendid 3.0 to 4.0 V6's spark any interest? That could > sure
> be my cup of tea.
>
> corky
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: (email redacted) [mailto:(email redacted)]
> Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2006 8:18 AM
> To: (email redacted)
> Cc: Abraham Mara; (email redacted)
> Subject: Re: - Building my second turbo Miata.... advice please
>
>
> While it can be done on the cheap, the normal approach is to use the
> Monster Miata kit. Plan on spending near $10k altogether for the completed
> project before you add hp to the engine. The stock 5.0 is rated around 225
> at the crank. The one that dynoed the same day I did got 220 TQ and 176HP
> at the wheels on a Dyno dynamics dyno.
>
> How much $4 went into that 380 HP 5.0 ? Approaching 300hp the blocks are
> known to split. Aftermarket blocks are as much as two or three junkyard > 1.8
> l Miata engines.
>
> Steve
>
>
>
> Ian McCloghrie
> <(email redacted)>
> To
> 11/01/2006 06:59 Abraham Mara
> PM <(email redacted)>
> cc
> (email redacted)
> Please respond to Subject
> (email redacted) Re: - Building my second turbo
> Miata.... advice please
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Nov 1, 2006 "Abraham Mara" wrote:
>> That said, why would you put in an NA V8 unless it was some hot shit? If
>
>
> There are people who've done V8 conversions on the cheap, using lots of
> labor and fabrication skill to do all of the conversion work themselves.
> If you have the skills and equipment, all you need to buy is a junker
> 5.0 Mustang, a t-bird rear end, and some custom half-shafts -- with
> appropriate resourcefulness you could probably do it for less than
> a grand. A few guys did a V8 Miata for the GRM 200x dollar challenge,
> spending less than 2 grand on the whole car.
>
>> you're not using forced induction then you're not serious about power on
>> pretty much any car you care to build. If you just want a v8 miata,
> fine,
>
> For a Miata motor, I tend to agree (unless rules force you to go NA).
> For other engines it's less obvious.
>
>> toss in 250 rwhp and say you've got it. I'd rather have a 300 hp
> screamer,
>> and it would be cheaper to build and easier to do than a v8 swap tuned to
>
>> that level.
>
> A friend of mine has a naturally aspirated 5.0 making 380/380 at
> the wheels, with at least 300 lb-ft all the way from 2500 to 6500 RPM
> (7K redline). I'd love to have a motor like that in a Miata. :)
>
> If you're already cramming a V8 under the hood, finding room for the FI
> compressor and intercooler makes it quite a bit harder. Cooling a big
> motor like that has got to be a lot easier without having an
> intercooler blocking your airflow as well.
>
> --Ian
>
> ______________________________________________________________________
> This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.
> For more information please visit messagelabs.com/email
> ______________________________________________________________________
>
>
> _____________
> This e-mail transmission and any attachments to it are intended solely for
> the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed and may > contain
> confidential and privileged information. If you are not the intended
> recipient, your use, forwarding, printing, storing, disseminating,
> distribution, or copying of this communication is prohibited. If you
> received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately
> by replying to this message and delete it from your computer.
>
>
________________________________________________________________________
Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more.

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: "Abraham Mara" <(email redacted)>

If you can host them, or want me to on my page, let me know. I've got all =
the webspace you could ask for.
-Abe.
----- Original Message -----=20
From: (email redacted)=20
To: (email redacted)=20
Cc: (email redacted)=20
Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2006 9:28 AM
Subject: Re: - Building my second turbo Miata.... advice please


Sounds like you are thinking of adapting a V6 to the Miata trans. Keep in=
mind that V engines usually have the starter low to fit the outside of the=
V while strait engines usually have them mounted high close to the block. =
Any adaptation for the Miata trans would likely have to take into account =
relocation of the starter. BTDT.=20=20

No drawings but I have captured many closeup pics of ebay transmission be=
llhousing patterns (resize in phtotshop and overlay to see pattern differen=
ces).=20=20




P.S. Are there drawings of the tranny mounting points on a BP engine anyw=
here? The FE3?=20
=20=20=20
----- Original Message ----- From: "corky" <(email redacted)>=20
=20=20=20
> Do any of the splendid 3.0 to 4.0 V6's spark any interest? That could >=
sure=20
> be my cup of tea.=20
>=20
> corky=20
>=20
> -----Original Message-----=20
> From: (email redacted) [mailto:stephen.m.clancey@Cummins.c=
om]=20
> Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2006 8:18 AM=20
> To: (email redacted)=20
> Cc: Abraham Mara; (email redacted)=20
> Subject: Re: - Building my second turbo Miata.... advice please=20
>=20
>=20
> While it can be done on the cheap, the normal approach is to use the=20
> Monster Miata kit. Plan on spending near $10k altogether for the comple=
ted=20
> project before you add hp to the engine. The stock 5.0 is rated around =
225=20
> at the crank. The one that dynoed the same day I did got 220 TQ and 176=
HP=20
> at the wheels on a Dyno dynamics dyno.=20
>=20
> How much $4 went into that 380 HP 5.0 ? Approaching 300hp the blocks ar=
e=20
> known to split. Aftermarket blocks are as much as two or three junkyard=
> 1.8=20
> l Miata engines.=20
>=20
> Steve=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Ian McCloghrie=20
> <(email redacted)>=20
> To=20
> 11/01/2006 06:59 Abraham Mara=20
> PM <(email redacted)>=20
> cc=20
> (email redacted)=20
> Please respond to Subject=20
> (email redacted) Re: - Building my second turbo=20
> Miata.... advice please=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> On Nov 1, 2006 "Abraham Mara" wrote:=20
>> That said, why would you put in an NA V8 unless it was some hot shit? =
If=20
>=20
>=20
> There are people who've done V8 conversions on the cheap, using lots of=
=20
> labor and fabrication skill to do all of the conversion work themselves=
.=20
> If you have the skills and equipment, all you need to buy is a junker=
=20
> 5.0 Mustang, a t-bird rear end, and some custom half-shafts -- with=20
> appropriate resourcefulness you could probably do it for less than=20
> a grand. A few guys did a V8 Miata for the GRM 200x dollar challenge,=
=20
> spending less than 2 grand on the whole car.=20
>=20
>> you're not using forced induction then you're not serious about power =
on=20
>> pretty much any car you care to build. If you just want a v8 miata,=20
> fine,=20
>=20
> For a Miata motor, I tend to agree (unless rules force you to go NA).=
=20
> For other engines it's less obvious.=20
>=20
>> toss in 250 rwhp and say you've got it. I'd rather have a 300 hp=20
> screamer,=20
>> and it would be cheaper to build and easier to do than a v8 swap tuned=
to=20
>=20
>> that level.=20
>=20
> A friend of mine has a naturally aspirated 5.0 making 380/380 at=20
> the wheels, with at least 300 lb-ft all the way from 2500 to 6500 RPM=
=20
> (7K redline). I'd love to have a motor like that in a Miata. :)=20
>=20
> If you're already cramming a V8 under the hood, finding room for the FI=
=20
> compressor and intercooler makes it quite a bit harder. Cooling a big=
=20
> motor like that has got to be a lot easier without having an=20
> intercooler blocking your airflow as well.=20
>=20
> --Ian=20
>=20
> ______________________________________________________________________=
=20
> This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System.=
=20
> For more information please visit messagelabs.com/email=20
> ______________________________________________________________________=
=20
>=20
>=20
> _____________=20
> This e-mail transmission and any attachments to it are intended solely =
for=20
> the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed and may > c=
ontain=20
> confidential and privileged information. If you are not the intended=20
> recipient, your use, forwarding, printing, storing, disseminating,=20
> distribution, or copying of this communication is prohibited. If you=20
> received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediat=
ely=20
> by replying to this message and delete it from your computer.=20
>=20
>=20=20


---------------------------------------------------------------------------=
---
Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security=
tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web,=
free AOL Mail and more.

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: Ian McCloghrie <(email redacted)>

On Nov 2, 2006 (email redacted) wrote:
> While it can be done on the cheap, the normal approach is to use the
> Monster Miata kit. Plan on spending near $10k altogether for the completed
> project before you add hp to the engine. The stock 5.0 is rated around 225
> at the crank. The one that dynoed the same day I did got 220 TQ and 176HP
> at the wheels on a Dyno dynamics dyno.

Sure. Conversely, while a turbo Miata can be done on the cheap, the
normal approach is to take our your credit card and start ordering parts
from the FM catalog. FM2, exhaust, clutch/flywheel, and radiator will
set you back $7500 without even thinking about it.

> How much $4 went into that 380 HP 5.0 ? Approaching 300hp the blocks are
> known to split. Aftermarket blocks are as much as two or three junkyard 1.8

I dunno exactly, but it was a lot. How much money goes into a 380 rwhp
FI Miata motor? According to FM's web site, a built 2.0 runs $10K.

--Ian

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: "Michael Burgess" <(email redacted)>

What about the probe/mx-6 v6...guys turbo those I think all day and put
down some mad power....

-Mike



-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Ebersol [mailto:(email redacted)]=20
Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2006 10:33 AM
To: Miatapower List
Subject: Re: - Building my second turbo Miata.... advice please

A guy put a Mazda 2.5 KL v6 in an NA (documented in the m.net engine=20=20
swap forum). That engine seems to work will with turbos too. I know=20=20
of an MX3 running 400whp at 15psi (AF 10.5:1). It's his daily driver-=20=20
been like this for two years. Says he shows "no mercy". That could be=20=20
fun. I loved the 95 v6 626 5spd I had.

On Nov 2, 2006, at 10:24 AM, corky wrote:

> Do any of the splendid 3.0 to 4.0 V6's spark any interest? That=20=20
> could sure
> be my cup of tea.



NOTE: This e-mail message is intended only for the named recipient(s) above=
and may contain information that is privileged, confidential and/or exempt=
from disclosure under applicable law. If you have received this message i=
n error, or are not the named recipient(s), please immediately notify the s=
ender and delete this e-mail message.

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: Rob Ebersol <(email redacted)>

same thing

On Nov 2, 2006, at 1:17 PM, Michael Burgess wrote:

> What about the probe/mx-6 v6...guys turbo those I think all day and
> put
> down some mad power....

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: "Michael Burgess" <(email redacted)>

Yeah opps...

-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Ebersol [mailto:(email redacted)]=20
Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2006 1:19 PM
To: Miatapower List
Subject: Re: - Building my second turbo Miata.... advice please

same thing

On Nov 2, 2006, at 1:17 PM, Michael Burgess wrote:

> What about the probe/mx-6 v6...guys turbo those I think all day and=20=20
> put
> down some mad power....



NOTE: This e-mail message is intended only for the named recipient(s) above=
and may contain information that is privileged, confidential and/or exempt=
from disclosure under applicable law. If you have received this message i=
n error, or are not the named recipient(s), please immediately notify the s=
ender and delete this e-mail message.

This read-only message was archived from a public mail list.
Mail From: (email redacted)

Per the GRM rules, I'll take it for $2003. :)

Wallyman





"Loercher, Scott"
<SLoercher@BH-BA.
com> To

11/02/2006 10:52 cc
AM <(email redacted)>
Subject
RE: - Building my second turbo
Miata.... advice please













>If you have the skills and equipment, all you need to buy is a junker 5.0
Mustang,
>a t-bird rear end, and some custom half-shafts -- with appropriate
resourcefulness
>you could probably do it for less than a grand. A few guys did a V8 Miata
for the
>GRM 200x dollar challenge, spending less than 2 grand on the whole car.


As co-owner of that car, I know how cheap it could be done. Our base car
was bought for $2300 and sold down to $0 before we even began the build. I
don't know if under $1,000 is possible, but we were under $2k even with the
expensive axels v8miata.com. The car is still street driven and auto-x'd
from time to time.


v8miata.homestead.com/buildup.html


That car will be for sale shortly, feel free to e-mail if interested.


-Scott