Miata List Archive

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Mail From: ndtusing (Neil Tusing)

The difficult part of driving a car with a standard
transmission is normally the coordination of clutch
and gas, both when starting from a stop and when
changing gears. It gets even more tricky if you?re on
a hill. A good way to teach someone the feel of the
clutch and to dispel fears of jerky starts or stalling
is as follows.

On the straight and level, put the clutch in
(disengaged) and shift into first gear. Now, with the
clutch in, with the left foot, tuck the right calf and
foot up under the left knee along the front of the
seat. This makes it difficult, if not impossible, to
quickly hit the gas. Gently ease the clutch out
until it?s completely engaged and the car is moving.
The car won?t stall, but will roll along just fine on
the idle. It may take a couple of tries to get
rolling before stalling, but you really get a good
feel for the clutch.

I didn?t believe this could be done without stalling
when I first heard it. However, I tried it in my ?01
LS, 6-speed; my ?02 Subaru, 5-speed; as well as a Z06
C5 Corvette and had no problems. Of course, the
torque of that Corvette did make a big difference. In
all cases, the cars had normal idles of maybe 700 to
900 RPM or whatever is stock. Of course you can?t
take much of an uphill grade on the idle. On the
level, though, once the car gets rolling, it will put
along quite nicely.

I?m a standard transmission fan, myself. I just like
to row through the gears. I have been in the
occasional traffic jam where it became a bit tedious.
You know, traffic moving a little too quick for first
gear, but not quite quick enough for second, so you?re
constantly going back and forth. Luckily, I rarely
run into these situations. If I lived in a city, I
might feel differently about my transmission choice.

On the other hand, automatic transmissions are
becoming more and more efficient and able to handle
gobs of torque. Look at the Chrysler Hemi or the
Porsche Turbo. In fact, for a turbo, the automatic is
probably better than a standard. The slip in the
automatic allows the turbo to maintain boost. With a
standard, boost starts to fall off as soon as you hit
the clutch. That?s why the automatic Porsche Turbo
('07 model) is quicker to 60 MPH than the 6-speed. I
wonder if FM has any experience with turbo?d,
automatic Miatas. Keith, any input in this regard?

I would like to try one of those transmissions with
the electro-hydraulic clutch, like the Ferrari F1, BMW
SMG, or the Audi S tronic with the twin clutches.
>From what I?ve read the shifts in the Audi are
extremely quick with absolutely no lag. I think this
twin clutch setup will be the coming thing in these
transmissions. I?d also like to try the new Miata
6-speed automatic. I don?t think I?d like it, but I
would give it a try. I could imagine an NC MSM with a
turbo and automatic. Might be quite a nice little
setup.

Neil Tusing
Dual Citizenship: Del-Val/LVMOC

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Mail From: dean (Dean Woodward)

Neil Tusing wrote:
> I have been in the
> occasional traffic jam where it became a bit tedious.
> You know, traffic moving a little too quick for first
> gear, but not quite quick enough for second, so you?re
> constantly going back and forth.

Lucky you- around here, traffic is either fine, or STOP and go; even
first is too high. If I had to commute on a regular basis, my left thigh
would be about twice as big as my right one...

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Mail From: RESOMMER (RESOMMER


I had good luck teaching my wife to drive stick using a 87 Plymouth Horizon
on gravel roads. After a couple of stalls she added more gas. After loosing
traction because of the gravel toss she found the right spots for both clutch
and gas. The sound was a great feedback system.

Gravel and hills taught her finesse and good use of the handbrake.

Pavement and gravel both have good points when teaching stick.

Rick

In a message dated 5/31/2007 2:03:03 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
ndtusing at yahoo.com writes:

A good way to teach someone the feel of the
clutch and to dispel fears of jerky starts or stalling
is as follows.







************************************** See what's free at aol.com.
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Mail From: Tim.Mullen (Mullen, Tim)

I have taught many people (including my wife, both my kids, and
most of my friend's girlfriends) to drive a manual without problem.
You just have to be patient, and let them know that they will
probably stall it once or twice and it's no big deal.

I teach the use of the clutch by having the car stopped on flat
level ground (a huge parking lot). Without giving it any throttle,
slowly lift the clutch until it just starts to grab (the RPM
drops, and you can "feel" it). Then gently apply a little bit
of throttle, lift the gas a little bit, more throttle, etc.
I usually demonstrate the movements with my hands. A couple
of starts this way and they get it real quick. They will
usually do too much gas at least once causing the engine to
rev and the clutch to slip, but no big deal. They will often
stall, or more likely cause the car to "buck" once or so, but
that's good so they know what it feels like.

The next step is to practice pulling in and out of parking
spots - over and over. They have to learn to "creep" the car,
lightly feathering the clutch without applying any throttle
to keep the car moving at slower than idle speed with the
clutch out. This only takes a couple of tries to do it,
and a half hour to do it perfect.

The next step is to start on a slight hill. The method
is similar to the first start. Right foot on the brake,
left on the clutch. Lift until the clutch just starts to
grab (they've already learned what this feels like), and
then they rather quickly move the right foot to the throttle
and start out like normal. They usually have this down
pad by the second try. When they have that mastered, I
find a steeper hill and we try it again. I never teach
the "use the hand brake" method - it's a crutch, and not
all cars have a hand brake (lots still have a foot operated
parking brake).

The main thing is to be relaxed and not to freak out when
they do something wrong...

Tim Mullen
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Mail From: jon (Jon Etkins)

Mullen, Tim wrote:
> I teach the use of the clutch by having the car stopped on flat
> level ground (a huge parking lot). Without giving it any throttle,
> slowly lift the clutch until it just starts to grab (the RPM
> drops, and you can "feel" it). Then gently apply a little bit
> of throttle, lift the gas a little bit, more throttle, etc.
> I usually demonstrate the movements with my hands. A couple
> of starts this way and they get it real quick. They will
> usually do too much gas at least once causing the engine to
> rev and the clutch to slip, but no big deal. They will often
> stall, or more likely cause the car to "buck" once or so, but
> that's good so they know what it feels like.

I used a similar technique when teaching my wife to drive our first Miata, but rather than have her keep stopping and starting, I had her disengage and engage the clutch many times as we were slowly rolling along after that first jerky start. She was able to get a handle on the whole process more easily without having to worry about stalling, lurching, etc. Once she had a good handle on the concept of the engagement points and clutch feel, then we stopped the car and worked on starts and stops, with much less anxiety and only a couple of "kangaroo hops".

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Mail From: dillon.boyer (Dillon)

I don't understand the stop-n-go traffic arguments. In most parts of the
world people drive manual transmissions in all traffic conditions. I have
done quite a bit of stop and go in Chicago traffic and it really doesn't
bother me at all. I enjoy shifting, and the minor movements of my left foot
and right arm are no burden at all.
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Mail From: rsj (rsj)


On Jun 1, 2007, at 3:20 PM, Dillon wrote:

> I don't understand the stop-n-go traffic arguments. I enjoy
> shifting, and the minor movements of my left foot and right arm are
> no burden at all.
> _______________________________________________


I agree with you. I don't have a problem giving left leg and right
arm a little extra exercise.


Robert

95 Miata